"Cinavia" watermark protection

[averydxf]

why would any device makers want to include support for it?

[Woodstock]

If they want to be an official Blu-ray spec product, they have to include this and other copy "protection" support.

If you don't, you cannot put that fancy "Blu-ray" label on the front of your device.

[jonghotti]

The Oppo “jailbreak” firmware includes a very cool “ignore Cinavia” feature that is ON by default. Me thinks that this jailbreak firmware was fashioned from unreleased R&D firmware in use when they were adding support for Cinavia enforcement.

The DVDFAB stuff I’ve read is not a clean workaround for Cinavia and that it’s definitely audible in not a great sounding way. FWIW


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[jonghotti]

Whoops this is an ancient thread. I can confirm Cinavia is enforced during BDMV folder playback through the Oppo.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[Krawk]

Whoops this is an ancient thread. I can confirm Cinavia is enforced during BDMV folder playback through the Oppo.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Ancient thread is fine, Cinavia is here to stay and if you have something to add, by all means do so.
Doesn't the Oppo still not enforce Cinavia if you're playing an MKV file? What is this jailbreak you refer to?

[jonghotti]

Currently the Oppo DOES enforce Cinavia during file playback and will mute the audio when a protected chunk of data is detected. With the Oppo "jail broken" firmware installed the Oppo DOES NOT enforce Cinavia during file playback.

[jamisonia]

In my experience the Oppo does enforce Cinavia on BDMV folder playback. It does not on MKV file playback.

[Wolf359]

Does anyone know if JRiver Media Center does or does not support Cinavia?

[bgmi41075]

So except for hardware makers that also produce content (i.e. Sony, and I see that the Playstation 3 was one of the first devices to incorporate this), why would any hardware makers want to support it in any way?

[pneumatic]

I'm trying to understand how Cinavia watermark works... the wiki article seems to say that it somehow encodes an imperceptible distortion to the audio, but the distortion is encoded in just the right way that means any subsequent re-recording or transcoding of the audio will amplify the distortions and degrade the sound quality? Is my understanding correct here or am I way off? Does this mean a bitperfect FLAC transcoding of the audio would preserve the original imperceptible distortions?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cinavia

Also how does Cinavia get into mkv files? Is Cinavia defined in the codec specification somehow? So if a BD is encoded as h.264, does this mean Moving Picture Expert's Group (MPEG) worked with Cinavia so that any MPEG decoder should/must recognise Cinavia encodings?

[Woodstock]

MakeMKV is going to copy the audio files directly to the MKV. The data is a very low bandwidth signal within those. It would be below human perception. Per the article, it's basically one bit per five seconds. That's why it takes so long to trigger a decoder.

If you never play the video in a decoder designed to pick that up, it's useless. Units like the Oppo have decoders for it, to be "legal", but even they have exceptions as to whether or not they decode it. Most players available on computers ignore it.

[pneumatic]

So I was way off

So all it does is encodes some hidden data in the audio stream that says it's copy protected, and it's up to the decoding device whether to obey it or not.

Well, it doesn't seem like it should pose a problem as long as the playback device or decoder doesn't implement Cinavia. I use MPC-HC + LAV decoders (K-Lite "full" pack) and it seems they do not support Cinavia at all so I guess it's a non-issue for me.

[Woodstock]

Pretty much a non-issue. It's meant to trap "consumers" (you know, common people who watch video), who follow rules. In theory, it can be decoded by TVs and such, but units that do that would become big news in "our" market.