"Cinavia" watermark protection

[TempGuy1]

Is anyone aware of a tool or program that will tell you if your video file has Cinavia protection without having to play it in a Blu Ray player for over 20 mins?

[setarip_old]

Hi!

Most of such discs and or "jackets" bear the Cinavia icon...

[mattias83]

THIS CAN'T BE STRESSED ENOUGH - Please DO NOT make any reports based on anything "other than" BACKUP COPIES YOU YOURSELF HAVE MADE of legitimate, commercial discs, because doing so will render this effort useless. "Other than" includes any and all downloads, screeners, cams, copies obtained from others, etc.

and

@skittle

But it pertains to hardware as well as discs...

mainly

"Other than" includes any and all downloads, screeners, cams, copies obtained from others, etc

i do scrap metal recycling and me being in a college town i get lots of junk electronics from dumpsters of the apartments and dorm complexes and occasionally i run across dvds stuck in cheap dvd players people throw out

that is how i got the movie swat.

i also am using the blu ray drive pulled from a junk laptop that the was thrown out because of a faulty graphics chip (7 beep of death)

because i may get the movies from junk electronics and the drive from broken laptops or even some blu ray players use a sata drive.

i was wondering does recovering the disks and hardware from junk electronics constitute as "obtained from others" or do i have to rent or borrow in order to constitute "obtained from others".

if the latter then i will have to buy a blu ray drive and the said movies thereby having 2 copies of the movie.

i should note that the copy of swat i got is legit commercial copy NOT a dvdr copy.


thanks for the help

Is this even a serious question? Why would it matter how you obtained the disc as long as it's a commercial disc and not "pirated"? If you find the disc on the sidewalk near the trash because somebody is throwing it out, or if you find it in a thrift store for $1, how does that make it any less "official"?

[raist3001]

5 pages of responses and I am still not sure what the verdict is regarding cinavia.

I use makemkv to back up my brd to MKV. I have not had any problem playing any movies with this method via a USB HDD to my oppo 103 or streaming from my PLEX. The amazing spider-man plays perfectly, as does pacific rim, cloudy with a chance of meatballs.....


What should I be worried about ?

[SamuriHL]

As long as you play them on a device that doesn't have Cinavia detection, there's nothing to worry about.

[raist3001]

As long as you play them on a device that doesn't have Cinavia detection, there's nothing to worry about.

The oppo 103 has cinavia detection. My MKV files still play without issue.

Edit: from the oppo 103 forums....
We have reports that Cinavia detection is working only for BDMV backups, not for MKV or M2TS copies. Cinavia detection does happen for MKV files on optical disc, but not for those on a USB device, or over SMB or DLNA.

It is hard to believe this will be allowed for long.

So since I can confirm that my cinavia backed up BR MKV files work without issue via my USB HDD and streaming from PLEX, I refuse to do any more firmware updates to my oppo 103.

[SamuriHL]

Not all players that detect Cinavia detect it in all formats. Some only enable detection on discs.

[Chetwood]

The verdict has been clear all along: since it can't be removed without seriously degrading audio quality, you need to stick to players that ignore it.

[raist3001]

The verdict has been clear all along: since it can't be removed without seriously degrading audio quality, you need to stick to players that ignore it.

What clear verdict? As I said, my oppo 103 has cinavia detection. I have no problems when I back up my BR to MKV and play via my external HDD via USB or steam the MKV via plex.

I am trying to understand if MY OPPO ignores the cinavia detection since it's MKV via stream or USB, or it's the MKV container?

The amazing Spider-Man has cinavia detection, and I backed up a copy to mk4 to play on my ipad. And even this plays flawlessly. TAS has the cinavia logo.

[Chetwood]

The verdict you brought up a few posts up. Cinavia is not going away and you are lucky that your standalone does not respond to it in every container. This will likely change in a firmware update so your best bet is to stick to media players that won't ever respond to Cinavia.

[Scooby Doo]

Hi to everyone on the Cinavia watermark protection, although I have been using BD backups on my PC I have only just seen the Cinavia message on my Samsung BD-F5100 player today when playing an MKV file on a USB stick !
After searching the net I came across your discussion and have just joined this site to see what can be done about it.
To say I am a little peeved at this watermark is an understatement and am seriously thinking of examining the latest firmware download for my BD player to see if its possible to disable it that way !
But I would prefer some other alternative hopefully if a filter can process out the watermark without reducing the quality although this would still be an extra step before making the file into a playable MKV on my BD drive.
People need to seriously look at resolving this as sooner or later you won't be able to play MKV files, especially if VLC starts to include it in their updates. So I will be keeping several older versions of VLC from now on just in case !

[Romansh]

VLC does not have a Blu-ray player license, it'll never feature Cinavia (not to mention, patching it out would be trivial since it's open source).

Basically, all you need to work around Cinavia is… not use a Blu-ray player.

[Scooby Doo]

Romansh : Sorry, maybe I don't understand exactly how this watermark is working currently.

All I can see is currently a backup of a movie won't play on my BD drive via a USB stick.

Are you saying that if I made a complete backup of a Blu-ray movie onto another Blu-ray disk it will play on my BD drive ?

If this was so, it wouldn't defeat pirates, so I doubt that would work.

I believe that some of the watermark does get copied but not all of it, that is how they recognize that it is a pirate copy !

am I wrong ?

[Romansh]

Romansh : Sorry, maybe I don't understand exactly how this watermark is working currently.

All I can see is currently a backup of a movie won't play on my BD drive via a USB stick.

Are you saying that if I made a complete backup of a Blu-ray movie onto another Blu-ray disk it will play on my BD drive ?

If you keep it encrypted, perhaps (not sure if players check whether the disc is a BD-ROM or a BD-R). Otherwise no (see below).

More importantly, Cinavia is only triggered on devices that enforce it. The only devices that do are doing it because they are required to do so (in order to comply with the terms of their license with the Blu-ray Disc Association).

Thus it's a non-issue, in that all you have to do is to use a device without a BD Player license (i.e. anything that is not a Blu-ray player).

I believe that some of the watermark does get copied but not all of it, that is how they recognize that it is a pirate copy !

am I wrong ?

That is indeed incorrect. Cinavia triggers when:

1) the watermark is detected

AND

2) the source is NOT a commercial, encrypted Blu-ray disc (such as individual MKV/MP4/M2TS files, or non-encrypted Blu-ray discs)

[SamuriHL]

Just to clear up some misconceptions as to how cinavia works....

o) It is embedded in the audio stream at mastering time
o) It will survive all attempts at re-encoding
o) It survives in a mono microphone recording with absurdly low quality

Detection works like this:

o) Error message 1 is for illegal recordings made from theater recordings (so called "cam" recordings) and will trigger immediately
o) Error message 3 is for commercial blu-ray/dvd content and will trigger if the player detects the signal and AACS encryption is not detected. Signal detection is near immediate, but, there is a "grace period" of about 20 minutes before the audio is muted.

Obviously any re-encoded content with cinavia will trigger detection (mkv, mp4, etc). But so will playing an original with a product like AnyDVD enabled (unless, of course, you use the cinavia player removal option). Hope this helps clear it up.