Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

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XTrojan
Posts: 23
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2015 1:23 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by XTrojan »

RESET_9999 wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:17 am
Just got a Chromecast, and I confirm that it's a FEL DV capable device. The ending credits of Power rangers is bright white... FEL noise visible on test file as confirmed before. great player for my bedroom TV :)

player-led and tv-led seem to be behaving strangely ... on my C8 OLED I'm only getting LLDV(player-led) but on my cheap Vizio TV which doesn't support LLDV I get TV-led DV. HDR10 and SDR are color accurate.
*tested iTunes, Movies Anywhere, and PLEX

also, no red push in the Dr. Sleep p7 rip. The Shield is really the only device that has color issues and yet, the nvidia staff still say that they don't see any difference :lol: ...

Image
Hi! does it support MKV DV? And is there any issues like the ugoos had?
mulucy
Posts: 94
Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2020 7:08 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by mulucy »

DaMacFunkin wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 6:40 am
mulucy wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:28 pm
RESET_9999 wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:04 pm

The shield only supports MEL DV. it will play the FEL rip but will not decode the EL and will use only the dynamic metadata in RPU.
power rangers ending credits is dark grey and no FEL noise on the sample test file.



thank you
I appreciate it, thank you! I don't have any HD audio set up, will go with Google TV w Chromecast.
Hi, remember the GTVwCC does not support frame rate matching.
It should not be a big deal since I never use that functionality with my Vizio TV. The ladder is doing pretty good job removing any judder. But wonder if Google is planning on releasing a software update soon to address it.

Another question, is everybody using Plex to play the FEL files on GTVwCC?
RESET_9999
Posts: 473
Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2019 7:12 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by RESET_9999 »

XTrojan wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 10:19 am

Hi! does it support MKV DV? And is there any issues like the ugoos had?
yes, it supports DV MKV in PLEX, and from my quick testing session, it seems stable but I didn't watch a whole FEL movie yet. Lossy audio must be selected before playback otherwise the server complains about not being fast enough to convert truehd. At least lossy audio bitstreaming works. Also, this is a wifi device, so not sure how it handles the high-bitrate movies but should be fine thanks to the 5ghz. network info app showed 433 Mbps(which is obviously spec speed and not real-world speed).
mulucy wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 12:42 pm
It should not be a big deal since I never use that functionality with my Vizio TV. The ladder is doing pretty good job removing any judder. But wonder if Google is planning on releasing a software update soon to address it.

Another question, is everybody using Plex to play the FEL files on GTVwCC?
it doesn't auto-match the frame rate but there is a 23.976 mode in display settings so there is no judder and playback is smooth on the app I tested(plex, iTunes, movies anywhere).
there's no 24fps mode so most of the original Netflix movies will stutter every 42sec in 23.976. 60hz will be fine.
Last edited by RESET_9999 on Sat Apr 10, 2021 5:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Please forgive my English.
Sony x700 ----> Denon AVR ----> LG OLED C8
FIX the x700 DT-DL TS bug with this file
DaMacFunkin
Posts: 292
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:17 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by DaMacFunkin »

RESET_9999 wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 2:38 pm
XTrojan wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 10:19 am

Hi! does it support MKV DV? And is there any issues like the ugoos had?
yes, it supports DV MKV in PLEX, and from my quick testing session, it seems stable but I didn't watch a whole FEL movie yet. Lossy audio must be selected before playback otherwise the server complains about not being fast enough to convert truehd. At least lossy audio bitstreaming works. Also, this is a wifi device, so not sure how it handles the high-bitrate movies but should be fine thanks to the 5ghz. network info app showed 433 Mbps.
mulucy wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 12:42 pm
It should not be a big deal since I never use that functionality with my Vizio TV. The ladder is doing pretty good job removing any judder. But wonder if Google is planning on releasing a software update soon to address it.

Another question, is everybody using Plex to play the FEL files on GTVwCC?
it doesn't auto-match the frame rate but there is a 23.976 mode in display settings so there is no judder and playback is smooth on the app I tested(plex, iTunes, movies anywhere).
there's no 24fps mode so most of the original Netflix movies will stutter every 42sec in 23.976. 60hz will be fine.
I had from day one and sold it after 4 weeks, wasn’t for me.
captainbrent
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2018 8:27 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by captainbrent »

RESET_9999 wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 2:38 pm
Also, this is a wifi device, so not sure how it handles the high-bitrate movies but should be fine thanks to the 5ghz. network info app showed 433 Mbps(which is obviously spec speed and not real-world speed).
Apparently, there is an optional power adapter with built in ethernet capability! Unfortunately with only lossy audio, this is not for me.
RESET_9999
Posts: 473
Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2019 7:12 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by RESET_9999 »

captainbrent wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 7:04 pm
RESET_9999 wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 2:38 pm
Also, this is a wifi device, so not sure how it handles the high-bitrate movies but should be fine thanks to the 5ghz. network info app showed 433 Mbps(which is obviously spec speed and not real-world speed).
Apparently, there is an optional power adapter with built in ethernet capability! Unfortunately with only lossy audio, this is not for me.
great, just ordered one. thank's
Please forgive my English.
Sony x700 ----> Denon AVR ----> LG OLED C8
FIX the x700 DT-DL TS bug with this file
RESET_9999
Posts: 473
Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2019 7:12 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by RESET_9999 »

quietvoid wrote:
Thu Mar 11, 2021 1:22 am
Right, but I wouldn't personally consider bad shadows a good experience even if it's brighter :wink:
At least that's what I've noticed. HDR is supposed to have good lower range as well, which isn't the case with Dolby Vision on these TV sets.
I've edited the test pattern in the post a little late, here it is again:
It's FEL so you can compare HDR10 and Dolby Vision.
Hi there,

ok sorry for the late reply, it took me a while to check this pattern but indeed, DV black level is wrong compared to HDR10. It is very obvious in my pitch-black room. I decided to check it out after noticing the ugly raised black on ''All man kind'' on my Shield. Then I went back comparing some movie that I remembered having terrible black level when I watched them in DV (I assumed it was how they graded it) and I actually always compared brighter scenes which are easier to capture with my camera.

so on my x700, I checked Atomic Blonde Dual-layer rip. if you pause at 34sec(frame 848) the image is dark grey/black in both HDR10 and DV but you can't see the black bars at all in DV, they are elevated while in HDR10 you can clearly see the darker black bars. the DV version actually looks like a full screen 16:9 movie for a couple of frames lol .

Just to be sure the problem was not my x700, I checked All mankind P5 DV on the Shield which as I said, I noticed has elevated black too. again right in the first few seconds of episode 8, perfect black level in HDR10 but ugly raised black in DV.

Are sure this is only a problem with these TV sets because not only I'm seeing the same thing on my Vizio tv but I can also capture it with my x700 dv to HDR conversion(no c8 in the chain) which I thought was faulty because of the black level but I now think it turns out that it actually captures how the black level are messed up in DV. to me all of this sound like a major issue with DV algorithm.

dual-layer FEL black level pattern comparison: https://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/13253
* represent exactly what I'm seeing in a pitch-black room. of course, check out this comparison with all the lights off.

Atomic blonde 34sec frame 848: https://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/12921
*again represent exactly what I'm seeing in real life. also, the difference is only very obvious in a completely dark room.

all of this is disappointing to me, a lot, I almost wish you never told me that lol ... its either a punchier/brighter image in DV with horrible black level or a darker HDR10 image with better contrast and inky black level.
Last edited by RESET_9999 on Thu Apr 22, 2021 1:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
Please forgive my English.
Sony x700 ----> Denon AVR ----> LG OLED C8
FIX the x700 DT-DL TS bug with this file
quietvoid
Posts: 87
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2020 4:15 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by quietvoid »

RESET_9999 wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 9:54 pm
Hi there,

ok sorry for the late reply, it took me a while to check this pattern but indeed, DV black level is wrong compared to HDR10. It is very obvious in my pitch-black room. I decided to check it out after noticing the ugly raised black on ''All man kind'' on my Shield. Then I went back comparing some movie that I remembered having terrible black level when I watched them in DV (I assumed it was how they graded it) and I actually always compared brighter scenes which are easier to capture with my camera.

so on my x700, I checked Atomic Blonde Dual-layer rip. if you pause at 34sec(frame 848) the image is dark grey/black in both HDR10 and DV but you can't see the black bars at all in DV, they are elevated while in HDR10 you can clearly see the darker black bars. the DV version actually looks like a full screen 16:9 movie for a couple of frames lol .

Just to be sure the problem was not my x700, I checked All mankind P5 DV on the Shield which as I said, I noticed has elevated black too. again right in the first few seconds of episode 8, perfect black level in HDR10 but ugly raised black in DV.

Are sure this is only a problem with these TV sets because not only I'm seeing the same thing on my Vizio tv but I can also capture it with my x700 dv to HDR conversion(no c8 in the chain) which I thought was faulty because of the black level but I now think it turns out that it actually captures how the black level are messed up in DV. to me all of this sound like a major issue with DV algorithm.

dual-layer FEL black level pattern comparison: https://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/12918
* represent exactly what I'm seeing in a pitch-black room. of course, check out this comparison with all the lights off.

Atomic blonde 34sec frame 848: https://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/12921
*again represent exactly what I'm seeing in real life. also, the difference is only very obvious in a completely dark room.

all of this is disappointing to me, a lot, I almost wish you never told me that lol ... its either a punchier/brighter image in DV with horrible black level or a darker HDR10 image with better contrast and inky black level.
I don't know about other TVs but with my C8, blacks in Dolby Vision with an HDMI input are more elevated than the internal apps.
Some people say only the Apple TV suffers from this but it also happens with my Firestick 4K. So I end up using brightness 49 everywhere, but this significantly crushes near-black.

I've personally reported the issue to LG but according to sspears IIRC the issue needs to be fixed by Dolby.
I was just told they would look at it (sent examples) and that the issue would be fixed in a firmware update. That was a month ago.

It's a sad situation..
RESET_9999
Posts: 473
Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2019 7:12 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by RESET_9999 »

quietvoid wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 10:24 pm

I don't know about other TVs but with my C8, blacks in Dolby Vision with an HDMI input are more elevated than the internal apps.
Some people say only the Apple TV suffers from this but it also happens with my Firestick 4K. So I end up using brightness 49 everywhere, but this significantly crushes near-black.

I've personally reported the issue to LG but according to sspears IIRC the issue needs to be fixed by Dolby.
I was just told they would look at it (sent examples) and that the issue would be fixed in a firmware update. That was a month ago.

It's a sad situation..
yep, I can see the issue on ALL my devices/TV and it's really only noticeable in a dark room with an oled so I get why some people won't notice it but it sure looks like a Dolby issue.
Very sad. I guess that explains why everytime I'm impressed by the black level in a movie, it's always with HDR10 movies.
Please forgive my English.
Sony x700 ----> Denon AVR ----> LG OLED C8
FIX the x700 DT-DL TS bug with this file
captainbrent
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2018 8:27 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by captainbrent »

RESET_9999 wrote:
Sat Apr 10, 2021 8:03 pm
great, just ordered one. thank's
You are very welcome...let us know if it works alright!
XTrojan
Posts: 23
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2015 1:23 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by XTrojan »

Can someone install Kodi on the latest chromecast and see if it supports FEL playback with lossless audio and no bugs? Been thinking of buying it but hesitating due to how the ugoos turned out
morbius
Posts: 116
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2018 7:17 am

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by morbius »

[/quote]
ok sorry for the late reply, it took me a while to check this pattern but indeed, DV black level is wrong compared to HDR10. It is very obvious in my pitch-black room. I decided to check it out after noticing the ugly raised black on ''All man kind'' on my Shield. Then I went back comparing some movie that I remembered having terrible black level when I watched them in DV (I assumed it was how they graded it) and I actually always compared brighter scenes which are easier to capture with my camera.
[/quote]

don't know if this is relevant, but with my Panny HZ980, when the DV mode is TV-led ("mode 1" in the Panny menu), black levels are elevated far too much across multiple sources (Shield/Plex playing mkv's, ATV streaming apps, Sony X700). My go-to test scene is the saloon bar in Back to the Future 3 about 30mins into the film. The bar looks flood-lit with TV-led DV. If I switch to player-led DV, the black levels are much more sensible, and the picture looks right, more aligned to HDR10 on the ATV and HDR10+ on the Vero 4K. No idea if this is a Panny issue or a Dolby issue.
lexyz
Posts: 95
Joined: Fri May 08, 2020 5:32 am

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by lexyz »

I'm quite sure it's Dolby 8)
For now there is so many issues with Dolby Vision on various devices.
Can't wait for a new S&M UHD HDR Benchmark disk with DV patterns. :roll:
So many wonderful discoveries await ahead :lol:
Bravia XF90, Shield TV Pro'19, UBP-X700
RESET_9999
Posts: 473
Joined: Mon Aug 05, 2019 7:12 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by RESET_9999 »

XTrojan wrote:
Sun Apr 11, 2021 7:31 am
Can someone install Kodi on the latest chromecast and see if it supports FEL playback with lossless audio and no bugs? Been thinking of buying it but hesitating due to how the ugoos turned out
DV MKV on kodi triggers DV for a second and stop. HD audio passthrough is not supported.
-for DTS-HD DTS-X, it will bitstream the DTS lossy core
-for TrueHD, it will send audio as LPCM stereo
- lossy DD+ atmos and DD bitstream works
- same behavior on PLEX but it will play DV MKV as long as the selected audio is not TrueHD.
- DD+ atmos works on iTunes but not on Movies Anywhere.

I'm not able to get tv-led DV on my OLED C8, tried many times, no luck. HDR10/SDR/DV are all sent in 422 12bits and the colors are accurate on the C8. So it looks like the chromecast default DV mode is LLDV and only display that doesn't support LLDV get TV-led DV.

On my Vizio TV(doesn't support LLDV), I get tv-led DV but then HDR10/SDR are stuck in 444 8bit resulting in incorrect HDR10 colors just like the ugoos device. SDR 8bit 444 is color accurate though.
In the display settings, if I select 24hz SMTP, then HDR10/SDR are 444 12bit and colors are accurate but I lose DV on everything (plex iTunes Ma vudu fandango etc). Also, every time you switch from 24hz to 24hz SMTP, you have to reboot the device.

Itunes is converting DV to HDR10 on the fly like the appleTV used to do. It's sending random metadata. Movies anywhere send pure HDR10 stream. Didn't test the other apps.


Vizio 24hz mode HDR10 (DV works but incorrect 8bit in HDR10)
Image

24hz SMTP mode HDR10: (same for vizio and C8) (DV doesn't work but 12bits in HDR10)
Image

OLED C8 (no tv-led support):
Image

Vizio DV (tv-led support):
Image


iTunes DV in HDR10 (wrong metadata)
Image

Movies anywhere DV in HDR10 (proper metadata)
Image
Please forgive my English.
Sony x700 ----> Denon AVR ----> LG OLED C8
FIX the x700 DT-DL TS bug with this file
mulucy
Posts: 94
Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2020 7:08 pm

Re: Dolby Vision now possible through MP4 Mux.

Post by mulucy »

RESET_9999 wrote:
Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:57 pm
XTrojan wrote:
Sun Apr 11, 2021 7:31 am
Can someone install Kodi on the latest chromecast and see if it supports FEL playback with lossless audio and no bugs? Been thinking of buying it but hesitating due to how the ugoos turned out
DV MKV on kodi triggers DV for a second and stop. HD audio passthrough is not supported.
-for DTS-HD DTS-X, it will bitstream the DTS lossy core
-for TrueHD, it will send audio as LPCM stereo
- lossy DD+ atmos and DD bitstream works
- same behavior on PLEX but it will play DV MKV as long as the selected audio is not TrueHD.
- DD+ atmos works on iTunes but not on Movies Anywhere.

I'm not able to get tv-led DV on my OLED C8, tried many times, no luck. HDR10/SDR/DV are all sent in 422 12bits and the colors are accurate on the C8. So it looks like the chromecast default DV mode is LLDV and only display that doesn't support LLDV get TV-led DV.

On my Vizio TV(doesn't support LLDV), I get tv-led DV but then HDR10/SDR are stuck in 444 8bit resulting in incorrect HDR10 colors just like the ugoos device. SDR 8bit 444 is color accurate though.
In the display settings, if I select 24hz SMTP, then HDR10/SDR are 444 12bit and colors are accurate but I lose DV on everything (plex iTunes Ma vudu fandango etc). Also, every time you switch from 24hz to 24hz SMTP, you have to reboot the device.

Itunes is converting DV to HDR10 on the fly like the appleTV used to do. It's sending random metadata. Movies anywhere send pure HDR10 stream. Didn't test the other apps.


Vizio 24hz mode HDR10 (DV works but incorrect 8bit in HDR10)
Image

24hz SMTP mode HDR10: (same for vizio and C8) (DV doesn't work but 12bits in HDR10)
Image

OLED C8 (no tv-led support):
Image

Vizio DV (tv-led support):
Image


iTunes DV in HDR10 (wrong metadata)
Image

Movies anywhere DV in HDR10 (proper metadata)
Image
Would you recommend Chromecast with Google TV based on the test results you are getting? I am not into any serious lossless audio setup, it's all lossy since I live in the apartment ( I don't even have Atmos speakers, will get them once I move into my house later ). My main concern is the support for DV FEL and other HDR formats with my Vizio PX Quantum and TCL 6 Series. I mainly watch movies from UHD disk backups .

Just to add more to my comment, I am very happy with my Fire TV Sticks 4K. They are rock solid, do support MEL DV and have auto frame rate on top on most apps.

Thank you again!
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